what are my rights with police? - Page 2

**Full Noise** · 18-05-2007, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pertuan

With regards on how to treat police officers when they approach you/stop you for something, its quite simple. Ask yourself how you would prefer to be treated if you were said police and treat them that way. I've encountered police only a few times but I find that if you treat them with the same amount of respect that you expect in return, then you'll be fine.

Interesting comment, Pertuan. I like the way you think. I get pulled over every now and then while at work for log book checks and the like and always treat the officers with the respect that I would like in return. If I get a copper that seems a little abrupt, although this rarely happens, I just bite my bottom lip. The police officer’s attitude depends largely on the reason you’ve been pulled over and your attitude. Rhyso, this officer obviously just wanted to send you a subtle message to watch your speed. Because he pulled you over and discussed it with you, you remembered it.

Look at the copper’s point of view. He has a job to do and from what I read of your first post, he was a fair cop. You can’t ask for any more than that.

bob 351 · 18-05-2007, 11:57 AM

I have always found that if you are polite and honest with most police they treat you the same way but have a smart mouth look out

superpursuit83 · 18-05-2007, 12:06 PM

Just dont get out of your car in America, they will shoot ya...

18-05-2007, 12:18 PM

I've had a mix of good and bad.

I have respect for police who respect me, and I've probably been pulled over about 25 times. Theres 2 bad incidents though:

First was the first one, was a RBT and defect station. Took my first car off the road basically and fined me. But this didn't so much bother me. It was his attitude towards me calling me a d***head and my car a s***box.

The second one was pretty recent, pulled over because he though I had my fog lights on and first looking at the front he then came back to me and pretty much sprawled himself and the associated equipment hanging off them over the rear drivers side door, window and roof whilst leaning in talking to me. The scratch-x got a good working the next day.

Bill_R · 18-05-2007, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAYBA

i dont believe all police think this way once i have been asked to wait in the vehicle but thats because i was on the road...most appreciate it when you are awaiting them with your licence in hand, but i suppose not all, some dont like it when you set in your car like king **** waiting for them to come to you.

And how would you know who likes you to stay and who doesn't? The standard advice has always been to wait in the car and I'll do and recommend that. Each to their own. I've only been pulled over for breath tests so I haven't even thought of getting out.

What I've heard before and my agreement is that staying in the car puts you in a passive role. Leaving the car and standing up to the officer is more confrontational and possibly agressive. I'd have my license ready to present (it's a mongrel to get out of the plastic cover) but wouldn't present it unless asked. I think leaving control to the officer is the best appraoch.

Bill_R · 18-05-2007, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Noise

The police officer’s attitude depends largely on the reason you’ve been pulled over and your attitude.

And the mood they are in and we can all get "moody". It might have nothing at all to do with you so your advice to bite your bottom lip is more than sound.

Hext · 18-05-2007, 01:13 PM

If you have been stopped it's for a reason. Something as small as checking the driver has a licence is enough. If you are defensive or argumentative dont expect any favours from the copper. My advise would be to stay in the car when stopped unless you are asked to get out. Remember you are on the side of the road, as soon as you get out of the car the coppers duty of care means he/she has to make sure you are safe. If you feel better getting out go and stand on the footpath/verge out of harms way.

You have to present your licence, if you dont have that then you will have to give your name, date of birth and current address. If you are honest then you shouldnt have many dramas. Remember you can contest any infringement in court. If you believe you are innocent then plead not guilty to the ticket and state your case to a magistrate. If you have recieved an infringement then the copper is confident that he has the evidence to prove your guilt in court. Hence the reason rhysy_boi got a warning. Coppers dont have to show you the reading on the radar but may do if they want.

As people have said, they are doing a job, most people get crap service at the supermarket once in a while because the checkout chick is having a bad day, same goes for coppers i spose.

Redrum · 18-05-2007, 01:41 PM

In Victoria police have the power to intercept any vehicle and ask the identity of the driver. They do not need a reason. This can be a routine check. If there are any offences involved the police must be satisfied with the identity of the driver. If they are not, then under the Road Safety Act, they have an arrest power, until identity is confirmed.

Best thing to do if intercepted by police is give your name and address, hand over your licence and then listen to why you were intercepted. If the police do not give you a reason just ask them, in a polite manner, why they have pulled you over.

The people that fail the attitude test generally make matters worse. The police may start to wonder why this person is so aggressive, have they got something to hide and is there anything wrong with the vehicle. Of course this does not mean you need to be a suck, just polite. If the police officer treats you unfairly, take notes, and speak to their officer in charge.

JAYBA · 18-05-2007, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill_R

And how would you know who likes you to stay and who doesn't? The standard advice has always been to wait in the car and I'll do and recommend that. Each to their own. I've only been pulled over for breath tests so I haven't even thought of getting out.

What I've heard before and my agreement is that staying in the car puts you in a passive role. Leaving the car and standing up to the officer is more confrontational and possibly agressive. I'd have my license ready to present (it's a mongrel to get out of the plastic cover) but wouldn't present it unless asked. I think leaving control to the officer is the best appraoch.

i dont "know" some officers will prefer different things i spose, i have 2 inlaws who are police and they say exactly that..some will prefer different things but if not parked clearly off the road you stay in the vehicle. i have found getting out and greating with my licence and a nice attitude has done me very well(gives a chance for the officer to get a taste of your attitude and what your about) not just sitting there like a stuffed duck...but who cares you do as you do in the circumstances.

rhysy_boi · 18-05-2007, 03:40 PM

cheers guys. i admit i was let off lightly and i'm not trying to have a go at the cop or anything, i have just never before thought about what my entitlements are when i am talking to a policeman.

if you don't ask, how can you learn?

Rhyso

[dave] · 18-05-2007, 05:32 PM

another good thing is that if u get done for sumthing lil like not wearing a seat belt

argue the point if it is 1 on 1

get teh fine

take em to court PROVE resonable doubt

u win

**Full Noise** · 18-05-2007, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [dave]

another good thing is that if u get done for sumthing lil like not wearing a seat belt

argue the point if it is 1 on 1

get teh fine

take em to court PROVE resonable doubt

u win

u carnt b serious.

Is this post a joke? If not, you’ve got a lot to learn about the justice system.

Redrum · 18-05-2007, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [dave]

another good thing is that if u get done for sumthing lil like not wearing a seat belt

argue the point if it is 1 on 1

get teh fine

take em to court PROVE resonable doubt

u win

That is true. If you are willing to stand in a court room and lie, you will get off quite a few minor traffic fines, as not many magistrates, will call you a liar. Traffic laws have the same burden on truth as criminal laws. But you will go to court, waste a day for the mention date, waste a day for the contest mention, waste a day for the contest and unless you can prove the police have acted in bad faith it is unlikely you will get costs, whilst the police are paid for being there.

jaydee · 18-05-2007, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redrum

That is true. If you are willing to stand in a court room and lie, you will get off quite a few minor traffic fines, as not many magistrates, will call you a liar. Traffic laws have the same burden on truth as criminal laws. But you will go to court, waste a day for the mention date, waste a day for the contest mention, waste a day for the contest and unless you can prove the police have acted in bad faith it is unlikely you will get costs, whilst the police are paid for being there.

Mmmm. The word PERJURY springs to mind, with an automatic prison term.
Would be funny if you denied it and lied in Court then suddenly a dash cam or something turns up, pack your toothbrush and don't drop the soap in the shower.

:

Redrum · 18-05-2007, 10:07 PM

I have heard a few people lie giving evidence. I just cannot prove this.

XT_5L · 18-05-2007, 10:57 PM

I live in a small town just off the victor harbour rd, lots of crashes and deaths on this road and as a result the cops do random rbt's at night. They pop out of nowhere and pull you over, they rbt u and will then ask a million questions of what r u doin out at his time and what i do for work and so on. it takes anywhere form 1 minute to the record of 25 minutes.
my car with a full car load sits quite low on the suspension as all do, ive had numerous threats of being defected for it when i get pulled over but allways get off on the point of if my mates get out the car it wont sit low as your car does. as the rear wheels of there cars r normally in the arches ive rearly been questioned anyfurther than that.
one funny night tho there was a cop on the side of the road and flagged me in behind him, went through all the usual and the lowerd thing cam up, i said the usual and he said his commodere was standard, luckely for me my lights were still on and i could see his tyres i then pointed out that the inner edges of his rear tyres were wearing uneven cos his car was lowered and they were on the wear marker making them defectable, i was s***ting bricks at this point cos i it more or less just came out with out me thinking about what i said, i say since i told him i was a mechanic befor he replied with allrite off u go smarta**.

ED Classic · 18-05-2007, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

They would get sus I'd reckon with "no comment"
probably end up getting your car searched,could be best is to give nothing up by playing dumb "Im not sure sir" or " I dont know" type of thing..

No No No No No

This is the mistake alot of people make, And if they do end up Fineing you/Charging you and you are innocent or want to contest it anyway you have increminated yourself...All of a sudden you are 100% sure but you said you were not sure, You do know when you clearly said you didnt, You do remember all of a sudden when you said "I dont remember".

Alot of time you are being recorded for a confesion or any "Dont rember" etc evidence that can later be used against you.

ED Classic · 18-05-2007, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Noise

u carnt b serious.

Is this post a joke? If not, you’ve got a lot to learn about the justice system.

Well about Police powers anyway...

Laminge · 18-05-2007, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [dave]

nah if they get sus and start with the " if u dont speak we will defect ur car" and u have a passenger just say " that sounds like a threat to me and i will b reporting u to the police station, wats ur badge number"

worked once b4 lol

English may get you a better response as well, keep the SMS style to your phone and not the forums

XR8 Uterous · 18-05-2007, 11:57 PM

While we are on police matters.

Late last year (december 19th) I was pulled over and fined for my back p-plate not being on, it was one of the sticky ones and it had fallen onto my back parcel shelf.

The cop that pulled me over even said that he could see the p-plate on the back shelf had fallen off, but still proceeded to fine me for it. When i asked if this would result in loss of points as the ticket only said back p-plate, for this he told me no, now recenlty haing checked my points and have noticed i have been deducted 2 points, any chance of appeal on that given that the cop told me i wouldnt lose points, knowing i would of lost points i would of contested the fine.

VSSII · 19-05-2007, 12:28 PM

P Plates have to be conspicuously displayed. If the car behind couldn't see it then thats not the case.

**GasoLane** · 19-05-2007, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [dave]

nah if they get sus and start with the " if u dont speak we will defect ur car" and u have a passenger just say " that sounds like a threat to me and i will b reporting u to the police station, wats ur badge number"
worked once b4 lol

Squalo · 21-05-2007, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [dave]

another good thing is that if u get done for sumthing lil like not wearing a seat belt

argue the point if it is 1 on 1

get teh fine

take em to court PROVE resonable doubt

u win

I believe Darwins Law is immune to the 'reasonable doubt' defence.

nugget378 · 21-05-2007, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ED Classic

No No No No No

This is the mistake alot of people make, And if they do end up Fineing you/Charging you and you are innocent or want to contest it anyway you have increminated yourself...All of a sudden you are 100% sure but you said you were not sure, You do know when you clearly said you didnt, You do remember all of a sudden when you said "I dont remember".

Alot of time you are being recorded for a confesion or any "Dont rember" etc evidence that can later be used against you.

Wont work hey.
One night a little rice rocket comes up beside this worked over V8,at every set of lights he was rocketing off,then slowing down and doing it again to bait the other driver into a race.
Well at one set of lights the V8 driver had had enough,so gives it a bit of curry,didnt go too fast mind you but the noise could be heard 3 suburbs away,over a hill they go with the old V8 way out in front when down the bottom of the hill a police car with lights flashing had someone pulled over,when they approach the cop car both get waived in.
The copper states that the conversations are being recorded,and he asks do you know what the speed limit is?
Yes says the V8 guy.
And how fast were you going?
Geez officer,not sure,the speedo is in miles,but I really doubt more than about 40 mph.
Come on says the copper I could here your engine from all the way over the hill.
Doubt that was me sir,I think it could have been a car going the other way.
The liitle ricer driver,on his red P's mind you admits to going 110km/h,gets booked and does his license,while the other guy gets an off you go,and bloody slow down...
How is not being sure incriminating yourself?
Admitting to something is incriminating,alot of times the only evidence might be what you admit too.
You do not have to put up a defence in court at all,they have to prove facts,if they have them your gone whatever you say 99% of the time.
you have to prove nothing,
this isnt a legal get out of gaol card or probably good advice in most situations,but its better then being a smartass and getting bent over by the side of the road.

Matty4 · 21-05-2007, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

Admitting to something is incriminating,alot of times the only evidence might be what you admit too.
You do not have to put up a defence in court at all,they have to prove facts,if they have them your gone whatever you say 99% of the time.
you have to prove nothing

A little OT, but this also applies to speed camera related offences also. By paying the fine you are admitting it was you. If you say it wasn't you, and can't identify the driver, then they have to prove who it was.

**Full Noise** · 21-05-2007, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty4

If you say it wasn't you, and can't identify the driver, then they have to prove who it was.

Sorry mate. It’s you that has to prove who was driving. Someone still needs to be nominated as the driver.

b2tf · 21-05-2007, 03:38 PM

I love these sorts of threads, theyre always a great read. Mainly because you can take note of all the heroes who say "oh i never tell the cops anything, they have to prove it and they can get stuffed etc etc", and then 6 months later you see their username starting threads like this one asking how to get out of fines.

Oh and just to clarify, rhysy_boi, that's not meant to be a shot at you for starting this thread.

Point being though, if you get pulled over, for a good reason or just for the hell of it, 99 times out of 100 there is no special trick to getting out of it, there is no special magic word you have to say to get away with it, you just have to be calm, polite and, if need be, cop it on the chin.

Yes some cops are turds, yes I have met some of them, and others I am good mates with. If you think you've been hard done by take it up with the right people in the right manner (and that doesnt mean call them pigs and ask for their badge number), if you do the wrong thing and get caught, well what did you expect. If you get away with it, good for you but dont expect it every time.

Sorry to sound like a parent here, and again I dont mean any crap to you rhysy for starting the thread, it just amuses me to see some of the same old replies here.

Gunns · 21-05-2007, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Noise

Sorry mate. It’s you that has to prove who was driving. Someone still needs to be nominated as the driver.

If you can prove you have taken all possible messures to find the driver of that car, you will cop the fine and not the points.

ie: you lend your car to 2 friends each of them say that they were not driving at the time of the camera went off, there is no clear picture of the driver of the car. They both sign stat decs saying that they were in the car but were not the driver of the car at that point in time.
You pay the fine and no loss of points as you commited no offence and the points system is there to penilise the offending driver not the ower of the car. I have done this before and has worked.

rhysy_boi · 21-05-2007, 06:17 PM

i'm not trying to find out how to get out of fines guys. the whole point of starting this thread was to find out how i am expected to respond to police in a situation. but cheers for all your replies and to anyone who did have a go at me, well i was doing the wrong thing (albeit by accident) so i can cop it.

Rhyso

67XRT · 21-05-2007, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhysy_boi

i'm not trying to find out how to get out of fines guys. the whole point of starting this thread was to find out how i am expected to respond to police in a situation. but cheers for all your replies and to anyone who did have a go at me, well i was doing the wrong thing (albeit by accident) so i can cop it.

Rhyso

From personnel experience I usually let the driver tell me what occured or their interpretation of what they have been pulled over for. You would be surprised the number of people that just blurt out what they have done. Makes the job so much easier to present and prove the offence.

"Look I was only doing eighty I'm sure of that"

Me "Thats fine Sir however, the posted limit is sixty and you carried that speed through to the forty KLM zone, so thank you for your honest appraisal of your speed"

Picture the shoulders, bottom lip and head drop all at once....

Again people like this have no problem passing the attitude test.

On the other hand....."What the #$%^ have I done, I've done nothing wrong, you blokes are just !@#holes, booking any one in sight"

"Ok sir thats fine however I thought you may want to know your wallet is sitting on the roof of your car and probaby will not stay there long in the manner you are driving, would you mind popping out your licence for me "