Overtaking, Just how hard it is to do it Safely and Legally! - Page 2

Vesper Martini · 06-09-2012, 12:17 PM

My issue is when the you hit the nice straight to pass that person that was doing 90kph suddenly seems to speed up as well.
you then have to choose top go harder, or back off and sit behind them..
There is often a look of shock when they see you next to them as if "how dare you"

H.G · 06-09-2012, 12:23 PM

its a maximum speed limit

MAD · 06-09-2012, 12:41 PM

120 is all that's needed to overtake a car sitting at slightly below 100. Yeah more is better, but 120 is enough to get the job done fast enough.
I just did a trip on the weekend and did this a couple of times. No one was in danger and I was able to continue on without worrying about the car in front.
You generally overtake where the vision is good and the road is straight. Risks are minimal.

Actually on this trip I had a car following me, closer than a 2 sec gap, then all of a sudden a cop car overtakes him and pulls in behind me. I was lucky to be able to see the badge on the grill.
I thought to myself, they'll slow down and increase the gap, but no. They stayed there until it was clear to overtake me. Very uncomfortable.
Good to see them leading by example.

If I see someone close behind me that wants to go faster than I am, I will move left in the lane to let them know I am happy for them to overtake and when they do, I will get off the gas to let it happen faster.

mik · 06-09-2012, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leighm

Because what happens you end up with a convoy of banked up cars. The slow one at the front is usually the type that sits anywhere between 80-100 (then they speed up to 110 when they hit the overtaking double lane road). When the person in front slows to 80, the people further back slow to 60 as they have to slow more than the car in front to maintain a safe distance between cars.

If I can sit on 100 with my cruise on that's what I want to do. I don't want to have to constantly check my speed because the moron in front can't maintain their speed.

i can remember a on a run west in one afternoon, sun low in the sky(and in the eye`s)past horsham(single lane),
a heap of banked cars in front, one old fart, speed varying between 80 and 100, he managed to bunch up cars for about a k maybe more, and he went on like this for about 20 kilometers, this caused some people to get impatient and make unnecessary ,some risky overtaking maneuvers,
very frustrating when you strike dudes like this, and the sod would speed up in the over taking area`s
i think most people don`t care if someone sits on a steady speed even if it is slower than the limit as long as they are easy to be easily passed,, the worst part is these bastards that can`t keep a steady speed and cause danger to others will never get booked.

Smoke Pursuit · 06-09-2012, 01:26 PM

Should be allowed atleast 15%.....

Anyone who thinks its okay to do 150 passing a B Double isn't okay in the head.... Ever had a tyre blow out on a truck next to you?

Olbucko · 06-09-2012, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Should be allowed atleast 15%.....

Anyone who thinks its okay to do 150 passing a B Double isn't okay in the head.... Ever had a tyre blow out on a truck next to you?

If the truck blew a tyre when your behind it you could be in a lot of trouble too, you may be better off to overtake it as quickly as possible, BUT NOT on double lines, curves, and hills, as so many idiots are starting to do today. And don't tailgate him, If he can see you in his mirrors he may slow a little, pull over a bit, and make things a bit easier for you.

**Silver Ghia** · 06-09-2012, 03:12 PM

Absolutely ridiculous situation not being able to overtake safely, which is to be on the wrong side for minimal time (within reason). Nothing more dangerous than crawling past the car being overtaken. The manoeuvre must be done decisively and quickly without hesitation once committed.

What do the road safety authorities want, headon collisions or drivers overtaking safely? Seems they are more interested in speeding fines than people being killed.

Smoke Pursuit · 06-09-2012, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

Absolutely ridiculous situation not being able to overtake safely, which is to be on the wrong side for minimal time (within reason). Nothing more dangerous than crawling past the car being overtaken. The manoeuvre must be done decisively and quickly without hesitation once committed.

What do the road safety authorities want, headon collisions or drivers overtaking safely? Seems they are more interested in speeding fines than people being killed.

Not necessarily... Most 2 lane highways (decent ones) have overtaken lanes every 10 kms.... The expectation is that if you cannot overtake safely you should wait for these lanes.

I drive a Kenworth on the weekend which is speed limited to 100 kms an hour.... being speed limited at 100 makes you alot more cautious how and when you overtake, typically in an overtaking lane. Most of the time the cars etc I overtake back off to let me past, other times I just have to wait till safe.

In saying that I see people try and overtake me in the truck (even when I am doing 100) at ridiculous speeds when there is no need for it, then jam the brakes on in my face once they are past....

I still think 15% is fair... 115 on a 100 speed limited road... If you don't have enough room to pass doing 115 then you need to be more patient and wait.

**Silver Ghia** · 06-09-2012, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Not necessarily... Most 2 lane highways (decent ones) have overtaken lanes every 10 kms.... The expectation is that if you cannot overtake safely you should wait for these lanes.

I drive a Kenworth on the weekend which is speed limited to 100 kms an hour.... being speed limited at 100 makes you alot more cautious how and when you overtake, typically in an overtaking lane. Most of the time the cars etc I overtake back off to let me past, other times I just have to wait till safe.

In saying that I see people try and overtake me in the truck (even when I am doing 100) at ridiculous speeds when there is no need for it, then jam the brakes on in my face once they are past....

I still think 15% is fair... 115 on a 100 speed limited road... If you don't have enough room to pass doing 115 then you need to be more patient and wait.

Agreed, 15-20% is fair, but that is over the speed limit when you can be pinged. They should make that legal.

And certainly, overtaking while you are doing 100 in the truck is unnecessary, and especially applying the brakes once back in front of you.

There are many 2 way roads I know where overtaking areas do not exist at all, there is one which I travel on frequently and people have come to grief along that road. They have put up cable barriers, but that doesnt help the overtaking situation, the money would have been better spent on overtaking areas.

blackf6 · 06-09-2012, 03:43 PM

Well out on most highway's around the country where you see trucks overtaking each other; we are usually in radio contact with each other and the vehicle being overtaken slows down until the maneuver is completed, and usually the slower vehicle will call you around when it is safe to do so. I also have a two way in my car and use the same methods, thus no speeding when overtaking, just work together. I work on the theory that if a vehicle behind has caught up to me whilst I am sitting on the speedlimit and if I let them pass they will also be able to drive away from me thus not impeding me or them.

new2ford · 06-09-2012, 03:49 PM

A lot of this angst would be avoided if European driving protocols were followed. There, on a single lane road, if there's room on the shoulder, a slower car will move over to the side (the left in Australian terms), still driving, to allow a faster car behind to pass. You do it every time, no question. In Australia only the occasional truck driver will show such consideration. Road authorities are now extensively putting in wide shoulders on new/upgrade work so there's plenty of scope for pulling over to let others pass.

Consideration for others and watching the mirror is something that should be rammed in at the learner stage and absorbed into driver behaviour.

blackf6 · 06-09-2012, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teak81

Well out on most highway's around the country where you see trucks overtaking each other; we are usually in radio contact with each other and the vehicle being overtaken slows down until the maneuver is completed, and usually the slower vehicle will call you around when it is safe to do so. I also have a two way in my car and use the same methods, thus no speeding when overtaking, just work together. I work on the theory that if a vehicle behind has caught up to me whilst I am sitting on the speedlimit and if I let them pass they will also be able to drive away from me thus not impeding me or them.

But in saying this if I am on a trip in the falcon, I just take my chances with the law and yes I will go 10% over the limit to pass safley.

**Silver Ghia** · 06-09-2012, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teak81

But in saying this if I am on a trip in the falcon, I just take my chances with the law and yes I will go 10% over the limit to pass safley.

Thats the point I'm trying to make, legally you cannot go over the limit at all. Also when overtaking the eyes have to be looking at the road ahead for anything unexpected, not at the speedo. Maybe to get around that an idea is to set the speed warning for 110kph, which is the speed where the higher fine and 3 demerit points come in.

Ben73 · 06-09-2012, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blk6t

Agreed, or there are the ones that do 75km/h in a 90 zone then continue to maintain the 75km/h when the speed limit reduces to 60km/h.

Yep always happens here. Cannot stand it.

80 limit, single lane, many cars drive at 70.
Then the speed limit drops to 60, another lane starts and how fast does everyone go.... 70 still.

blackf6 · 06-09-2012, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

Thats the point I'm trying to make, legally you cannot go over the limit at all. Also when overtaking the eyes have to be looking at the road ahead for anything unexpected, not at the speedo. Maybe to get around that an idea is to set the speed warning for 110kph, which is the speed where the higher fine and 3 demerit points come in.

Well maybe like the yellow advisory signs that say the safest speed for said corner, there could be a different color sign with the overtaking speed limit. But the catch is you can only do that speed whilst overtaking another vehicle.

zakjames · 06-09-2012, 06:42 PM

As new2ford brought up the attention of,

Before I had traveled through Europe and even Dubai I must admit I was much more selfish on the road then I am today (Was about 18 at the time). I narrowed it down to the fact I had only ever driven in conditions with other selfish people on the road with me. But seeing the driving and selflessness of people on the road in Europe, and even the initiative of those in Dubai putting on their hazards lights when approaching a red light around a blind corner I completely changed my habits to a much safer and courteous driver with much more awareness around me. If everyone was to experience how other drivers act on the road in European countries it would be a much safer and predictable place to drive here in Australia.

Nova 8 · 06-09-2012, 08:12 PM

If the car in front is doing 97 and the limit is 100, you dont over take. Even if you travel for 10hrs at 97 instead of 100 it only adds about 20mins to your trip. If i find it too frustrating (generally when I cant just set cruise) I just pull over and get a drink and a bite to eat as someone with only 1 probationary point I am not gonna risk it. The other choice is you knowingly risk the points and over take and when you get caught cry hard done by. Its that simple, as for when people are doing >10km under the speed limit you just over take. If my memory is correct it takes 2km to over take a B-double doing 100km if you are traveling at 110km. All this is covered in the learners book, having a read might be advised.

Just a note, I didnt lose my license for speeding. I lost my license as my P plate peeled off the window on a hot day and the cop behind me saw it, pulled me over and fined me - its breach of my provisionary license and i immediately lost my license. Appealed for it back and got a 3 yr extension... 3 mths to go until i get my p's. Currently all 4 of my P plates are taped to my windows.

prydey · 06-09-2012, 08:28 PM

whilst many think speeding isn't dangerous or contributing to the road toll, i fully believe attitude and impatience is one of the biggest contributors to the road toll.

this thread highlights just how prevalent impatience is in our society.

rather than allow plenty of time for your journey, you get annoyed at the person who dares hold up your important life for 5 min.

pottery beige · 06-09-2012, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teak81

Well out on most highway's around the country where you see trucks overtaking each other; we are usually in radio contact with each other and the vehicle being overtaken slows down until the maneuver is completed, and usually the slower vehicle will call you around when it is safe to do so. I also have a two way in my car and use the same methods, thus no speeding when overtaking, just work together. I work on the theory that if a vehicle behind has caught up to me whilst I am sitting on the speedlimit and if I let them pass they will also be able to drive away from me thus not impeding me or them.

done a night run karratha to headland in work ute.. ch40 for background...

pulled over just out of headland for a weeee....

ch40.... hahahaha check him out couldnt hang for another ten...

whoooosh goes a truck.. whoooosh goes another truck....

took the **** out of me for the next ten minutes..

tvboy · 06-09-2012, 08:41 PM

One of the worst things you can do is tailgate the vehicle you want to overtake. It means you have to get right over the dividing line to see oncoming traffic, which may already be through your windscreen when you see it. I just hang back 50ish metres, wait for a good clear stretch and sink the slipper. That gets you to overtaking speed before you cross the line. Doesn't give idiot drivers a chance to speed up to stop you getting past either.

tvboy · 06-09-2012, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

whilst many think speeding isn't dangerous or contributing to the road toll, i fully believe attitude and impatience is one of the biggest contributors to the road toll.

this thread highlights just how prevalent impatience is in our society.

rather than allow plenty of time for your journey, you get annoyed at the person who dares hold up your important life for 5 min.

Why do assume someone is annoyed or impatient just because they performing a simple overtaking manouvere? Slow drivers dont really bother me thats why my car has a steering wheel.
I don't get annoyed. I get around.

my_gxl · 06-09-2012, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bevsta007

My issue is when the you hit the nice straight to pass that person that was doing 90kph suddenly seems to speed up as well.
you then have to choose top go harder, or back off and sit behind them..
There is often a look of shock when they see you next to them as if "how dare you"

Loving the V8 for fixing this issue. I can be out and back under 300m.

pottery beige · 06-09-2012, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

whilst many think speeding isn't dangerous or contributing to the road toll, i fully believe attitude and impatience is one of the biggest contributors to the road toll.

this thread highlights just how prevalent impatience is in our society.

rather than allow plenty of time for your journey, you get annoyed at the person who dares hold up your important life for 5 min.

impatient.. nah.. i cant handle incompetence..

my_gxl · 06-09-2012, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nova 8

If the car in front is doing 97 and the limit is 100, you dont over take. Even if you travel for 10hrs at 97 instead of 100 it only adds about 20mins to your trip. If i find it too frustrating (generally when I cant just set cruise) I just pull over and get a drink and a bite to eat as someone with only 1 probationary point I am not gonna risk it. The other choice is you knowingly risk the points and over take and when you get caught cry hard done by. Its that simple, as for when people are doing >10km under the speed limit you just over take. If my memory is correct it takes 2km to over take a B-double doing 100km if you are traveling at 110km. All this is covered in the learners book, having a read might be advised.

Just a note, I didnt lose my license for speeding. I lost my license as my P plate peeled off the window on a hot day and the cop behind me saw it, pulled me over and fined me - its breach of my provisionary license and i immediately lost my license. Appealed for it back and got a 3 yr extension... 3 mths to go until i get my p's. Currently all 4 of my P plates are taped to my windows.

Plates should be on the extremities of the car, not in windows.

Nova 8 · 06-09-2012, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my_gxl

Plates should be on the extremities of the car, not in windows.

In SA the law is plates must be clearly visable from the front and the rear of the vehicle (rear only for motorbikes). In the window is perfectly legal.

Edit: had a read of the QLD law, how can you use a magnettic plate on the front of the car and have it "clearly" visable. Its Facing up not forward?

vanman_75 · 06-09-2012, 10:58 PM

I'm not inpatient , I give em the first and sometimes the second chance to go past a slower vehicle ....after that its my turn , take the lot , passing speed never enters the equation .I hate sitting behind people that are tail gating the slower vehicle , head on waiting to happen and I ain't gunna be no witness or part of that .caught in traffic with idiots will far outway me overtaking ...period !
Lessons learnt from 1-2 million clicks , I can just about tell you what the idiots are gunna do .awareness and courtesy would save more lives than any set rules , its the way I deal with it .and on the flip side I will drop away from bad displays of driving just as quick , for me its not the time test but more a - get there on my terms alive and safe deal .

GCRXR6 · 06-09-2012, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben73

What large city do you live and work in?

If you did long distance driving on country roads you will know it can make a massive difference in time. More then a song length, more like enjoy another album.

What is worse is people who cannot keep a constant speed.
Yesterday we were following some guy in a Falcon who was ranging from 105 to 70 in a 100 zone.
Problem was he wasn't slowing down for corners, he was just randomly slowing down and speeding up for no apparent reason.

Massive diference??? 100k trip .. one hour at 100 ... 50 minutes at 120. Wowwww save 10 minutes.

new2ford · 06-09-2012, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GCRXR6

Massive diference??? 100k trip .. one hour at 100 ... 50 minutes at 120. Wowwww save 10 minutes.

In another thread recently the issue of total time on the road, rest breaks and fatigue were discussed. The issue is a little bit more profound than "saving 10 mins". And it's certainly not an issue of patience. I've done plenty of slow hauls and know both sides of the story.

Actually I rarely overtake on single lane roads nowadays, I think it's too risky. I prefer to wait for overtaking lanes (if the idiot in front doesn't speed up in the overtaking lane).

I think it's more to do with consideration for those behind you than overtaking as such. To me the defining image of the Australian country road is the kilometre-long tailback behind the car doing 20 under the limit. Now, having said that, I don't have a problem with them doing 20 under. What I want them to do is look behind regularly and let those behind them pass. You don't see those tailbacks on European roads because of this consideration.

A bit of this and the need for dangerous overtaking will diminish.

zilo · 07-09-2012, 12:00 AM

I find going a bit over the limit makes me concentrate more and hence a safer trip....

So always overtaking and looking out fopr unmarked cop cars.

I go to sleep at the wheel on cruise and 99km/h

IDT · 07-09-2012, 12:11 AM

The OP is complaining about the guy in front doing 3kph slower. What is the accuracy requirement for a Speedo? If we all put our cruise control on 100kph everyone would have a brain explosion. Bit of patience required in that case. Those that sit on 80 in a 100 zone then there is no problem you can do your 20kph faster than the other guy. If you want to drive above the limit, and we are all guilty of it to varying degrees, dont complain when you get pinged for it we all know better.

New2Ford, you are dead right, its the lack of consideration for those behind, beside, infront and anywhere else thats the real problem.