issues with panel beater - what to do next?

Wretched · 07-06-2009, 12:23 AM

After having my car at the panel beater for three and a half weeks after some clowns decided it was good to use my car as a trampoline (now the cops have decided there isn't enough evidence to charge them with, is a black eye enough evidence?), i get it back with more issues than it went in with.

The place where RACV sent it to is **Edited** in (Victoria). I received the car back on Friday after waiting 3.5 weeks. All what was required to fix was a new roof, a new windshield and a small dent in the bonnet. Anyway get it back yesterday and notice these issues.

1) Driver's side door handle has been scraped
2) The rear two wheels have small chips taken out of them
3) The LHS washer jet is full of some kind of putty
4) The two red LED's where the interior light is are missing
5) The traction control system doesn't work anymore
6) There is overspray on the lower dam at the front of the car, yet no respray on the bumper bar was required.
7) Replacement windshield doesn't look to be fitted right, a bit of a gap in the lower corner of the drivers side (I have tested for leaks but haven't found any yet).

Now as soon as I noticed these issues I called RACV and basically asked WTF? They had the car 3.5 weeks and its come back with more problems, they basically said I have to go back to the same repairer due to a contract they have with them. I call edited and tell them, he said it couldn't have happened there as they don't drive the cars (I suspect this to be BS) and it had to have happened in the accident, of which I highlighted to the manager that there was no accident. They now want to see the car.
I wonder what kind of shop they're running there.

I am going to take the car back on Tuesday demanding these things be fixed and not take 3 weeks to do it. What I want to know is, am I asking too much? Do I have any right to demand these issues to be reparied?

In hindsight I wished I decided to choose my own repairer but the state of mind I was in I really just wanted the car to be fixed.

I do not recommend this place to anyone.

motorcycles4eva · 07-06-2009, 12:49 AM

take pics of how it is.. collect your evidence.. give rac what ever it is a chance to fix it again but keep a log book of whats happened from start to finish with time/day/date/ who you spoke to and what they have done..
i don't know how some places get contracts...???
don't tell them you're keeping a log book either until you have too..

Wretched · 07-06-2009, 12:50 AM

Hmmmm mods, would it be possible to please remove the repair center's name? Not sure of the legal issues that may occur.

Wretched · 07-06-2009, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by motorcycles4eva

take pics of how it is.. collect your evidence.. give rac what ever it is a chance to fix it again but keep a log book of whats happened from start to finish with time/day/date/ who you spoke to and what they have done..
i don't know how some places get contracts...???
don't tell them you're keeping a log book either until you have too..

The log book is a good idea. Cheers.
Yeah I have pics.

**cs123** · 07-06-2009, 07:16 AM

It's standard for your insurance to give the repairer a chance to fix the vehicle before getting involved.

We are all car enthusiasts here and have higher standards for repairs that average motorists. You need to consider this when choosing insurance/repairers.

If they resprayed the bonnet it is quite possible the bumper has overspray if they were careless. The washer jet is probably buff compound.

Some things like chips on the rims are impossible to prove and how does anyone know that it happened in the shop.

The traction control is serious and you need to get resolution from either the repairer or RACV.

Good luck.... it's crappy when this happens.

Yaw · 07-06-2009, 08:30 AM

Any time your car goes in for repair, be that accident or just for a tune up, make sure the person checking the car in does a "walk around" the car with you and make them take notes of exisiting damage they see and then both you and that person sign it and keep a copy for each. That way you have that to fall back on. I do this every single time my car goes in for service or repair. Saved me at Byrne Ford when they scracthed my door when I had my 2001 Escape, They had to fix it.

Geez Louise · 07-06-2009, 01:42 PM

A few years ago I was in an accident. The girl who hit me was talking on her mobile and ran straight into the back of me. My car was taken to the same chain of repairers that you mention Wretched.

I took a photo of the Odometer when I dropped it off and I can tell you, this particular branch where my car was, did drive the cars. I hope they enjoyed the 86kms they put on my car. My insurance company said that they allow 5 to 8km's added to the odometer.

I immediately confronted the owner and he said I must have been mistaken as they only drive the cars onto the hoist and out the shop to park etc.. I showed him and the insurance assessor the photos of the odometer. There was nothing he could say to deny it. He said one of his workers must have taken my car out. I was told that the insurance company would look into it further but I never heard the outcome.

The franchisee was given another opportunity to "fix" the sub standard repair he also did on my car but I stood my ground and said there was no way he was touching my car and that I wanted it moved to another repairer. The assessor agreed and my car was moved to another repairer within the hour.

I hope you get a satisfactory outcome. Take heaps and heaps of pictures and note everything down. Make your case to your insurance company as calmly as possible. Most insurance companies are reasonable when presented with evidence and will give you the opportunity to take it too your own repairer but let your insurance company know that you are not happy. They do review their list of registered repairers.

I hope you get a good result. Good luck with it all

gtfpv · 07-06-2009, 03:26 PM

my car is booked in for repairs now . the insurance company hurridly booked it in with a repairer of thier choice . i quickly withdrew the booking and booked it in with a repairer of my choice . repairer's of insurance companies choices ( in my own opinion) comply with a strict set of cheap and nasty rules to keep the insurers happy. ( example - they will only change one headlight in a front ender , if only one is broken, allowing a bodgey quickly recognisable differance upon pickup.
insurance and preferred repairers only have thier own businesses interests, not customers .
a good repairer , will often prefer not to be a "preferred repairer".
##### this is purely my own assumption ####

Yaw · 07-06-2009, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtfpv

my car is booked in for repairs now . the insurance company hurridly booked it in with a repairer of thier choice . i quickly withdrew the booking and booked it in with a repairer of my choice . repairer's of insurance companies choices ( in my own opinion) comply with a strict set of cheap and nasty rules to keep the insurers happy. ( example - they will only change one headlight in a front ender , if only one is broken, allowing a bodgey quickly recognisable differance upon pickup.
insurance and preferred repairers only have thier own businesses interests, not customers .
a good repairer , will often prefer not to be a "preferred repairer".
##### this is purely my own assumption ####

Best advice here is look at your policy and if it is right for you.
If choice of repairer is somethingb important to you, ensure your policy allows for it. (If it does not and you have shopped on price alone, you may not have that choice). Even if you do buy a policy that has the "choice of repairer" option - look at what the policy states.
For example, this is what the GIO Policy states:

Repairs
If we accept your claim and decide your vehicle can be repaired, we will arrange the repairs
with a repairer acceptable to us. If possible, we will offer you a choice of our Recommended
Repairers. If we consider it is not reasonably possible to offer a choice, we will nominate a
specific repairer.
If we accept your claim and decide your vehicle can be repaired, you can choose another
repairer but we might not authorise your repairs.
If we authorise repairs we will:
• repair your vehicle to its condition immediately before the event (this might not apply to
windscreen repairs or replacement)
• use only manufacturer’s approved parts for your vehicle if it is under warranty, but not
when the vehicle has an extended warranty or for windscreen replacement.
• use new parts or parts which are consistent with the age or condition of your vehicle
• guarantee the quality of materials and workmanship for the life of the vehicle. (See
Lifetime guarantee on page 26.)
If we do not authorise repairs our Lifetime guarantee will not apply (see page 26 for details).
We will pay the amount we assess to be reasonable by considering:
• your repairer’s quote with any adjustment or reduction recommended by an experienced
motor vehicle assessor we appoint or

Which essintally means if they don't agree with your repairer and they go ahead and do the repair anyway- YOU pay the difference and on the entire job you will NOT get the lifetime warranty.

gtfpv · 07-06-2009, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yaw

Best advice here is look at your policy and if it is right for you.
If choice of repairer is somethingb important to you, ensure your policy allows for it. (If it does not and you have shopped on price alone, you may not have that choice). Even if you do buy a policy that has the "choice of repairer" option - look at what the policy states.
For example, this is what the GIO Policy states:

Repairs
If we accept your claim and decide your vehicle can be repaired, we will arrange the repairs
with a repairer acceptable to us. If possible, we will offer you a choice of our Recommended
Repairers. If we consider it is not reasonably possible to offer a choice, we will nominate a
specific repairer.
If we accept your claim and decide your vehicle can be repaired, you can choose another
repairer but we might not authorise your repairs.
If we authorise repairs we will:
• repair your vehicle to its condition immediately before the event (this might not apply to
windscreen repairs or replacement)
• use only manufacturer’s approved parts for your vehicle if it is under warranty, but not
when the vehicle has an extended warranty or for windscreen replacement.
• use new parts or parts which are consistent with the age or condition of your vehicle
• guarantee the quality of materials and workmanship for the life of the vehicle. (See
Lifetime guarantee on page 26.)
If we do not authorise repairs our Lifetime guarantee will not apply (see page 26 for details).
We will pay the amount we assess to be reasonable by considering:
• your repairer’s quote with any adjustment or reduction recommended by an experienced
motor vehicle assessor we appoint or

Which essintally means if they don't agree with your repairer and they go ahead and do the repair anyway- YOU pay the difference and on the entire job you will NOT get the lifetime warranty.

that is to true . but look at what recommended repairers do to customers . mind you , when you drive a car away from the repairer , you are signing a contract 1st that the car is acceptable to you. <<<< ( and here lyes the catch) . all the repairer has to do is show the insurance company your signature , and then it's back on the onus of the vehicle owner . ( insurance companies are a lovely lot arent they ?) employing lawyers accountants , assessors and preferred repairers to do all the before work . and the customer signs off on the quality of repair < another CATCH.

buickman · 07-06-2009, 06:40 PM

I used GIO’s recommended repairer for my wife’s Mazda when someone came through a red light and hit her. When it came back there were a few issues I checked the car out and wrote list of what really needed to be corrected. I rang the accessor at Gio and told him about the issues and the car was arranged to be picked up from my house and delivered to the panel shop. They agreed to fix the issues and eventually did. I found no real problems in sending the car to the insurers nominated panel shop as the life time guarantee is what they have to agree to. Getting the car repaired by a third party becomes your problem if you decide on the repairs to be done by a 3rd party as the insurance company will still cut their quote down if is too high or adding extra components that are not related to the accident.

In the insurance company defence there are a lot of whinging shifty characters out there that modify their car and don’t let them know and expect damage from previous careless traffic or wear and tear encounters to be repaired under the same claim..
There in to make money so they will not payout for (e.g. bonnet struts not working unless it was clearly damaged by the accident) but people expect things like that to be repaired.

fastlane · 07-06-2009, 08:41 PM

Wretched, who was it? (Send me a PM please). I too am with RACV and I got sent to Phil Mundays who have done nothing but outstanding work for me. Good luck and I hope your car gets fixed ASAP.

BENT_8 · 07-06-2009, 10:33 PM

I used to insure with SGIC but never again.
Had to get an EF repaired after some tool punched a hole in the door and scratched door, gaurd and bonnet in a half arsed attempt to flog it.
Took it to get a quote from a well known local repairer, told SGIC they quoted about $1200.
They wouldnt have it as it wasnt one of their perferred mob.

Any how, long story short, car came back with both headlights scratched where they had allowed some clown to sand it back with the bonnet closed, sanding dust and fingerprints INSIDE the left hand indicator(sealed unit, obviously had been dropped, split open and reglued).

Took it back to SGIC, told them what had happened and that it wasnt going back to that joint and so it went to my original choice of repairer which eventually cost over $2k to fix, twice the original quote and all because the preferred repairer is supposedly better.

pauljh74 · 08-06-2009, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtfpv

my car is booked in for repairs now . the insurance company hurridly booked it in with a repairer of thier choice . i quickly withdrew the booking and booked it in with a repairer of my choice . repairer's of insurance companies choices ( in my own opinion) comply with a strict set of cheap and nasty rules to keep the insurers happy. ( example - they will only change one headlight in a front ender , if only one is broken, allowing a bodgey quickly recognisable differance upon pickup.
insurance and preferred repairers only have thier own businesses interests, not customers .
a good repairer , will often prefer not to be a "preferred repairer".
##### this is purely my own assumption ####

A mate works as a panel beater - he told me once how a major insurance company pushed the repairer to use 2nd hand parts..... on a BA Falcon less than a year old. The repairer stated that used parts were hard to find as the BA was fairly new, but the assessor insisted. On a new car, should be new parts. A 10 year old car, 2nd hand is fair enough.

motorcycles4eva · 08-06-2009, 05:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geez Louise

A few years ago I was in an accident. The girl who hit me was talking on her mobile and ran straight into the back of me. My car was taken to the same chain of repairers that you mention Wretched.

I took a photo of the Odometer when I dropped it off and I can tell you, this particular branch where my car was, did drive the cars. I hope they enjoyed the 86kms they put on my car. My insurance company said that they allow 5 to 8km's added to the odometer.

I immediately confronted the owner and he said I must have been mistaken as they only drive the cars onto the hoist and out the shop to park etc.. I showed him and the insurance assessor the photos of the odometer. There was nothing he could say to deny it. He said one of his workers must have taken my car out. I was told that the insurance company would look into it further but I never heard the outcome.

The franchisee was given another opportunity to "fix" the sub standard repair he also did on my car but I stood my ground and said there was no way he was touching my car and that I wanted it moved to another repairer. The assessor agreed and my car was moved to another repairer within the hour.

I hope you get a satisfactory outcome. Take heaps and heaps of pictures and note everything down. Make your case to your insurance company as calmly as possible. Most insurance companies are reasonable when presented with evidence and will give you the opportunity to take it too your own repairer but let your insurance company know that you are not happy. They do review their list of registered repairers.

I hope you get a good result. Good luck with it all

this would annoy the crikey out of me!!! when i worked at a bike shop in parramatta sydney, the workshop next door would take customers vehicles out the back and smoke the tyres.. i got stressed seeing that and it wasn't my vehicle.. this happened often.. that sux as you trust your goods with the hope it is repaired and they take advantage of it??
sorry for writing irrelevent stuff on this thread but needed to say that..

bathurst77 · 08-06-2009, 10:29 AM

Took my BA SR to repairer a few years ago after hitting a fox and taking out front bumper, lower bar grille etc.
When I booked it in, and when I dropped it off I told them "its not the std Falcon front bar, its the sports pack SR bar" got the yeh yeh, dont tell us our game fob off.
Picked up car week later
"guys you done a nice job, but you have put the wrong front on the car"
They wouldnt belive me, got a bit grumpy about it, said there was only the normal bar and the XR. Then I showed them photos of the car just after I bought it.

The resprayed areas were a different colour too.

buickman · 08-06-2009, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauljh74

A mate works as a panel beater - he told me once how a major insurance company pushed the repairer to use 2nd hand parts..... on a BA Falcon less than a year old. The repairer stated that used parts were hard to find as the BA was fairly new, but the assessor insisted. On a new car, should be new parts. A 10 year old car, 2nd hand is fair enough.

That would be right the assessor would have done his homework by ringing around wreckers to see what they are charging and if they have stock and the panel shop would have only fitted an new outer skin any way which would cost more as the labour that is required to do the job is more time consuming.

There really is nothing wrong fitting good second hand parts. But at no time are they allowed to use lower quality cheap imported panels on the car.

Does not matter how old or what type of car bieng $5,000 or $100, 000 . If you take out the normal lowest cost insurance they take the lowest quote and that can be your nominated repairer if he matches or is lower in the quote from the panel shops that go to quote on the repairs.

The assessors have supervisors who put the screws on them to save costs as do the supervisors from their managers .

The idea is to check out a insurance policy and see if it suits you.

ltd · 08-06-2009, 11:29 AM

I've had numerous issues with panel beaters, but am happy to say that after going through alot of crap repair shops I have found one that have done several jobs for me and are absolutely perfect in of all places; Greenacre/Bankstown. The place is called Premier Panel Beating and boasts all Australian staff (rare in that part of Sydney) who believe in Old fashioned service. The colour matching there is brilliant too, I've had several private jobs including the front bar on the G6E-T redone (when it was 4 months old) thanks to my father going to coles and painting their unmarked gutters (which now they are painted in signal yellow, and coles have paid for my repair after being reminded of their negligence to clearly outline obstacles for both motorist and pedestrian. Cheeky f***ers wanted to give me a voucher). Anyway, Premier are that good that Dale Ford use them for all paint repairs.

Some of the horrors that I've had though;
* BA LTD in Gunmetal Grey (taxi changed lanes into it) that had the whole side repainted and there were still sanding marks, pits in the paintwork and the colour used had no metalic in it. It went back three times and eventually was painted elsewhere.
* BA LTD in Navy Blue that had been run up the back and had a new bumper that hung down on one side and a boot lid that had almost touched the rear quarter. Paint was too metalic and had no gloss.
* Silver Honda Civic that my sister drove into a commodore, paint was dull and panel gaps were way off.
* BF LTD that was sideswiped when parked on a street. Panel fit was terrible, and the idiot painted the lower sconces in lightning strike as per the rest of the car and not that prism colour. (all the other sides had prism colour on the lower sconces).
* DL LTD that came back after a rear ender with bad panel gaps, and a Fairlane garnish panel on the rear. Overspray all round too.

In all cases these were resolved, but to the OP you just have to maintain the rage and don't make any comprimises. The panel beater has an obligation to fix the car, but I'd recommend that whenever your car goes into anywhere you take several photo's of the vehicle including the odometer in the prescence of the panel beater. (photos taken in private can be argued that they were taken weeks ago, you need a witness so be broad and include some parts of the shop in the background so it can be argued that the photos aren't doctored).

When they ask why mention that your insurance company suggests you do it because they have had several issues with vehicles at other repairers, and be prepared to mention some of the ones you have heard about here. This will not only slightly amuse the panel beater to hear of some stories, but it serves to let them know that you are aware of your vehicles condition so things like driving your car won't be tolerated. Then, ask for an expected date of completion and then don't hassle them in between i.e. ringing them every day.

LTDHO · 08-06-2009, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wretched

After having my car at the panel beater for three and a half weeks after some clowns decided it was good to use my car as a trampoline (now the cops have decided there isn't enough evidence to charge them with, is a black eye enough evidence?), i get it back with more issues than it went in with.

The place where RACV sent it to is **Edited** in (Victoria). I received the car back on Friday after waiting 3.5 weeks. All what was required to fix was a new roof, a new windshield and a small dent in the bonnet. Anyway get it back yesterday and notice these issues.

1) Driver's side door handle has been scraped
2) The rear two wheels have small chips taken out of them
3) The LHS washer jet is full of some kind of putty
4) The two red LED's where the interior light is are missing
5) The traction control system doesn't work anymore
6) There is overspray on the lower dam at the front of the car, yet no respray on the bumper bar was required.
7) Replacement windshield doesn't look to be fitted right, a bit of a gap in the lower corner of the drivers side (I have tested for leaks but haven't found any yet).

Now as soon as I noticed these issues I called RACV and basically asked WTF? They had the car 3.5 weeks and its come back with more problems, they basically said I have to go back to the same repairer due to a contract they have with them. I call edited and tell them, he said it couldn't have happened there as they don't drive the cars (I suspect this to be BS) and it had to have happened in the accident, of which I highlighted to the manager that there was no accident. They now want to see the car.
I wonder what kind of shop they're running there.

I am going to take the car back on Tuesday demanding these things be fixed and not take 3 weeks to do it. What I want to know is, am I asking too much? Do I have any right to demand these issues to be reparied?

In hindsight I wished I decided to choose my own repairer but the state of mind I was in I really just wanted the car to be fixed.

I do not recommend this place to anyone.

1. Call your claims consultant.
2. advise you are not happy with vehicle
3. you will have to take it back.
4. assessors will decide the next step.
5. you pick up vehicle and re inspect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fastlane

Wretched, who was it? (Send me a PM please). I too am with RACV and I got sent to Phil Mundays who have done nothing but outstanding work for me. Good luck and I hope your car gets fixed ASAP.

That's because Phil Mondays are the elite in panel beating!!

fastlane · 08-06-2009, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTDHO

That's because Phil Mondays are the elite in panel beating!!

LTDHO, you are so right! I go down there for private work as well and they do such a great job.

Wretched, if you want quality, go to Phil Mundays if you can, as they are RACV repairers.

gtfpv · 08-06-2009, 05:51 PM

when i had the EL XR8 it was PARKED OUT THE FRONT of the house and i didnt have a driveway as the house was brand new ( built) yet . the week CRAIG LOWNDES switched to ford . many xr8's suffered MALICIOUS DAMAGE that weekend , my car being one of them that particular night . 1 of 7 in my area.
anyhow i simply rang my insurer and got them to send a tow truck out , the car had a 2kg block of concrete thrown through the rear windscreen , which bounced off the dash -after smashing it then bounced up and smashed the front windscreen.
my mistake was letting the insurer look after it . i went down to thier prefferred repairer and explained that my car was a prestige xr8 which i'd owned since new and it is the family pride and joy , so could they please look after it and put a good tradesman on the car . the owner was courtious . i also asked for the glass shattered dust on the paint to be airbrushed off ( there was no paint or panel damage but i was concerned about the glasss dust on the paint)
anyhow 1 week later i get the call to pick up the car, to my surprise , there is shattered glass in the cabin, inside the boot , the new dash had a bubble in the vinyl, and the glass dust had been left sitting on the paint outside in the weather , and had now imbedded itself into the paint, unable to be washed away.
after a huge spew to the owner . also upon nfitment of the dash a bolt had been dropped causing a new serious rattle .
the car had to go to an auto electrician for a proper dash replacement and fitment , and further repairs onow on the paint to remove glass dust .
the owner apoligiseed as he told the 2nd year apprentice to do a good job on the car , after speaking to the apprentice myself , he told me he wasnt told to vacuum the inside of the cwsr or touch the paint work .
this is a preferred repairer who my insurance company quickly booked the GT IN with at this very moment for repairs .
not on my life . i have choice of repairer on my cover , and the car is booked in tomorrow at another repairer who has done work for my before and takes pride in the fact that he is not a preferred repairer .

Zedjay · 09-06-2009, 02:20 AM

back in 01 i got a new triton 4x4 work ute....had it two weeks and a young bloke cleaned it up....t
the kids father asked me to get some quotes because his access was $1700,

got 3 quotes from loacal smash shops and they were between $3200 and $3900,......so being so much i put it through my insurance and they sent me to their own repairer.
picked the ute up a few weeks latter and to my suprise the grill was colour coded white... the guy there says "we painted your new grill because the apprentice had chucked the old smashed one and we couldnt remember if it was white or black"......drove off happy.

about 3 weeks latter i was rear ended on pennent hills road and it pushed me into the car in front.... the grill was my old one repaired with bog as was one of the front gaurds.... the bumper brackets were my old one just bashed back into shape .
i had a spew about it and the repairer told me he had to do the job for less than $1600

he is no longer an @#$% approved repairer anymore

Wretched · 09-06-2009, 12:41 PM

Thanks for all the advice peoples, looks like i am not really alone on this, pretty disgusting really that these places feel they can cut corners. I know they're under pressure from the in$urance companies but still.

Well RACV have called me today and basically asked what issues there are, they're a little concerned with the missing LEDs and non functioning TC especially. They're going to send out an assessor to have a look at the car. Figured, like everyone said to play ball.