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The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
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28-10-2012, 05:02 PM | #1 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 658
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Ok so I know this might not be the done thing in our forum but I have to ask why do people keep buying this car over an fg falcon, surely it cant just be better marketing? My mates o8 SV6 has just gone bang at 117,000kms and its not an isolated incident.
Ive worked on dozens over the years and have rarely seen a reliable one. My mate is struggling to find a second hand engine coz there just isnt any around. In fact one wrecker told him they sell them as soon as they get them, where as the ford I6 gets sold for scrap usually coz they cant sell them! #Timing chains stretch # Engines sludge up despite religious servicing # Engine has NO torque, 3.6SIDI is better # Vision out of them is shocking # Omega interior makes XT interior look luxurious # Radiators, heater taps and water pumps leak Brand loyalty it would seem is alive and well, but the FG is a far better car, and some people need to wake up and smell the coffee! |
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28-10-2012, 05:09 PM | #2 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,374
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Repost.
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28-10-2012, 05:19 PM | #3 | ||
Pity the fool
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wait Awhile
Posts: 8,997
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The FG may be a better car, but at the end of the day people buy what appeals to them, and Holden marketing does a very good job at generating that appeal. What you should be asking is: why arent the usual usupects in the motoring media picking up on all of this?
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Fords I own or have owned: 1970 XW Falcon GT replica | 1970 XW Falcon | 1971 XY Fairmont | 1973 ZG Fairlane | 1986 XF Falcon panel van | 1987 XFII Falcon S-Pack | 1988 XF Falcon GLS ute | 1993 EBII Fairmont V8 | 1996 XG Falcon ute | 2000 AU Falcon wagon | 2004 BA Falcon XT | 2012 SZ Territory Titanium AWD Proud to buy Australian and support Ford Australia through thick and thin |
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28-10-2012, 05:20 PM | #4 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Gawler, SA
Posts: 1,707
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I serviced one yesterday. 45k oil filter sludged up, timing chain noisey. Drained ~3l out and put nearly 7l back in
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28-10-2012, 05:26 PM | #5 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 658
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Ive read pretty much all reviews on FG vs VE Road Warrior. Have to say 80% give the win to the FG by a narrow margin. Generally VE steers and handles slightly better and has a better seating position. FG according to most reviewers does everything else better. IMHO the margin increases significantly as the two cars start to put on some kms
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28-10-2012, 06:05 PM | #6 | ||
It's not an FG MKI.......
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Territory
Posts: 7,439
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I work with a couple of guys who have recently (in the last 12 months) bought brand new Commodores. One a Maloo and the other an SS.
I asked them if they compared them to anything else and why they bought a Holden. Their answer "because it's a Commodore".................... Not because it looked better or sounded better or went better or was better on fuel. Purely because it was a Commodore.
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06/08 Manual FG XR6T. Not an FG1 or MKI, an FG... Want to know how to do an A Service for an FG XR6T? Look in this http://fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11339404 Thinking of oil sampling your engine? Have a look at this trend http://fordforums.com.au/showthread....ght=oil+sample |
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28-10-2012, 06:11 PM | #7 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,338
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The only reason it sells is because its a ve Holden and the fg is a ford.
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28-10-2012, 06:13 PM | #8 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 658
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The diehard commodore fans will always buy commodore, and the diehard falcon fans will always buy falcons. Its the other 75% of large car buying consumers that I dont get. Put simply their should not be such a large discrepency in sales between the 2.
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28-10-2012, 06:21 PM | #9 | ||
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Foothills of the Macedon Ranges
Posts: 18,598
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People are like sheep sometimes.
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28-10-2012, 06:34 PM | #10 | ||
moderator ford coupe club
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,640
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some of us know the car we want long before we drive it
i will never have a holden and more than likely never a gm product either - that doesn't mean i will always buy a ford, but if i was looking for a brand new car for myself (and not my wife), then an fg would be very high on my list i know many people similar to myself but who are holden fans, so obviously they would not think about a ford when purchasing |
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28-10-2012, 06:59 PM | #11 | ||
Giddy up.
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Kramerica Industries.
Posts: 15,637
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I thought in the private sector of the large car segment, the Falcon outsold the Commodore, it was only fleet's and such where the Commodore made up it's sales ?.
If so then people do buy FG's over VE's. |
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28-10-2012, 07:05 PM | #12 | |||
moderator ford coupe club
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,640
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Quote:
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28-10-2012, 07:20 PM | #13 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,132
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It's certainly a sad state of affairs.
Last year, work had me in hire cars for a while, which were either XR6 FGs, or SV6 VEs. The VE's were a bastard to attempt bluetooth phone pairing. When test driving my FG this year, bang - it connected instantly - another sweetener. The V6s come across as very clunky, and the transmissions are so last century. The ****y spoiler position makes rear vision a thing of the past, and the mags look like puss, along with the pedestrian colour options. Just a few observations..... Cheers Steve
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FG Falcon Ute Daily: E-Gas 4.0 I6, 3 seat 1 tonner, 2300kg Tow Pack, Carryboy, XR6 rims. 6 Stacker, Sat Nav, Reversing Camera, Sunnie Holder, XR dash & St Wheel - thanks Mr FPV! Jaguar XJ-S: Eaton S/C, I/Cooler, Haltech, DB7 rims, 1:15 Wakefield. Jaguar XJ6 Wife's daily :2006 Quartz Metallic, FORD Duratec 3.0 V6, ZF 6sp Previous relationships: FG GT, FG XR8 (+BA XT 5.4, BA AU, EF, EB, EA, EA & XF work cars) Jags XJ12 & XJ6, BMW E39 Wagon, BMW F11 M-Sport wagon, 20 of GMH FC-HQ |
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28-10-2012, 07:39 PM | #14 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 135
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wow we have a ve sv6 commodore and we have a gtp,the reason we went to commodore is cause we didnt like the au,after owning a ford and a commodore i wouldnt put **** on either as they both have some problems,as for the ve being slow i dont think so
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28-10-2012, 07:51 PM | #15 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 658
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28-10-2012, 07:53 PM | #16 | ||
Mad Scientist!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Newcastle
Posts: 2,869
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They sell because..
1. They chase fleet sales. 2. They discount the crapper out of them 3. They premote the car as 'Australian's Own' 4. No Aussie Jurno will ever bag this vehicle. Even when parts of the door trim, glove-box fall off during the test. 5. Ford and Falcon I6 have a reputation of being extremely thirsty. My Boss and collegue hired a FG XR6 recently, major holden supporters. They came back and raved at how little fuel was used, how it felt so much better than the VE they had hired the wk previous. |
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28-10-2012, 08:04 PM | #17 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 658
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The poor fuel economy of the I6 is a myth. I remember about 3 years ago carsales I think they took a VE Berlina 3.0 SIDI and a FG G6 to Bathurst, did 161 laps at the speed limit. Guess what.. The Falcon was more economical. Even the current SZ Territory is criticised for its economy, yet its better than Kluger, Captiva, CX9 in petrol form
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28-10-2012, 08:20 PM | #18 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 390
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Ignorance!!
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28-10-2012, 08:26 PM | #19 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,876
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My VE is one of the most solid and reliable cars ever I have ever had. The big issue with the FG is the seating position, you are immediately put off by the car before you have even turned the key. My FG2 is a column shift and seems to feel a bit better as I can splay my legs out to compensate a bit. But how did the FG ever get signed off with that low steering wheel and high seat? Amateur hour.
And the styling, all the proportions of a EL Falcon. Falcon is the more modern drive, if only it looked it! And don't forget some consumers simply don't know any better and buy the more crap car. |
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28-10-2012, 08:39 PM | #20 | |||
Now Fordless
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Fremantle, WA
Posts: 3,611
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28-10-2012, 08:49 PM | #21 | ||
Giddy up!
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 2,126
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Is it because Holden wouldn't sell a rubbish vehicle?
I haven't driven a Commodore in a long while. When I did I didn't like it. But Holden don't sell rubbish do they? I can't think of an average Ford, but the Epica, Riva - yeah...average.
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Current: June 11 built Titanium TDCi Territory, Edge, side steps, mud spats, bonnet protector, tow pack, full tint. Nov 10 built XR6 Sensation. Previous: Oct 07 built Mondeo TDCi hatch, Stardust Silver, bluetooth, leather, tow pack, sunroof. |
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28-10-2012, 09:01 PM | #22 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 11,398
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Quote:
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28-10-2012, 09:04 PM | #23 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,078
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Here we go again.
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28-10-2012, 09:06 PM | #24 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: VN Capital
Posts: 1,584
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exactly^ if they were rubbish they would be recalled. This has not happened.
People who are holden buy generally buy holden. People who are ford generally buy ford. Id take a stab and say there is more holden then ford fans. So when the VE appeals to them, and are in the market, they will buy a VE. Even if a few ford fans tell em they are crap.. the FG is far superior.
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28-10-2012, 09:08 PM | #25 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 11,398
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This is a hard little period for Holden but VF promises to be a very good car technically,
so all the jibes leveled at VE will be mostly a thing of the past. There's a new game starting up in a couple of months time and Ford better be ready. |
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28-10-2012, 09:15 PM | #26 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: On The Footplate.
Posts: 5,086
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Yawn.
Ever actually driven a VE? Directly hopped out of a VE into an FG? It's honestly hard to find a bad new car today, and if you aren't badge-blinded, there's really a toss of a coin between a VE and a Falcon. The salesman at Holden when we were looking at an SV6 and wondering whether to buy it or an XR6 (but ended up with the G6E), he said that unless a potential customer brought it up, they didn't actually mention the "small" engine was only 3 liters to head off any preconceived notions about what it would be like. I've driven them, and they go just fine. We're talking street cars...not racing cars...we're talking about family cars that Joe Average is going to buy. I would bet hard cash that 90% of buyers off the street could care less about 0 to 100 times or quarter mile times or power and torque...as long as it's pleasant to drive, comfortable, roomy, nicely equipped, safe, and reliable, they could care less about the other stuff. When you mention "performance", they don't think "quarter mile", they think "how long between fuel stops". I love a spirited drive as much as the next guy and have always been keen on doing up cars and motorbikes, but when we were considering the two cars, I never even recall asking about power outputs or torque of the various motors on offer, apart from saying we wanted a six cylinder. I was more interested in price, features, trade in offer, warrantee, servicing costs, and stuff they were willing to throw in. |
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28-10-2012, 10:03 PM | #27 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Melb north
Posts: 12,025
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28-10-2012, 10:08 PM | #28 | ||
AFF Whore
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: In between gas stations
Posts: 2,246
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Me: "It's faster than a VE, it's more fuel economical than a VE, it shifts better than a VE (auto), costs less, insurance and rego is less so why isn't it a 'better' car?"
My mate: "Because it's a Ford" <-- Drives a Nissan |
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28-10-2012, 10:12 PM | #29 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: On The Footplate.
Posts: 5,086
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Interesting one about the "fat pillars". Look at any modern cars and pillars are "fat"...especially ones with airbags and other safety stuff.
Our WB ute still has the same basic architecture as the original HQ ute that was praised for having the "thinnest A-pillers of any production car" at the time, and they're still noticeably thin. Modern crash safety requirements would scotch a new car having pillars that thin... |
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28-10-2012, 10:21 PM | #30 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Townsville
Posts: 1,167
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I was impressed with the braking and handling was not impressed with the engine was a pain when overtaking foot to the floor and it doesnt go foot hal f to three quarters down and it goes better. |
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