BOSS 260 Vs Windsor 302 Inj

Windsor342ci · 08-10-2010, 08:48 AM

Good Morning all,

I have recently purcahsed a ELII XR8 merely as a project car as Ive always had a soft spot for that model.
Now originally the plan was to set aside around about 15K for engine work and the remiander 5K for cosmetics.

Though now Ive been hit with a delema. Ive been given an oppertunity to get my hands on a BF XR8 engine (30,000kms) along with the 6 spd manual tranny.

Though the question Im asking myself is, is it worth it? With all due respect unless you have intentions on working a 260, standard they ain't the most impressive engines. My main concern is that if I do opt with this conversion rather then the original plan of playing with the Windsor that throws me out 10K straight up leaving only 5 left for upgrades....

So my question is guys & girls;

Would you spend 15K on performance mods for a Windsor (200,000+kms) or
5K on a newish Boss 260..........

Iggypoppin' · 08-10-2010, 08:55 AM

Boss260 mate. Straight up. The boss is a tough motor, and if you want to boost it it'll make bigger power more reliably than the Windsor. That and it's something different, I dont think a boss has been put into an e series yet. You might need to massage the shock towers and trans tunnel to get it all to fit though. Good luck!

HULK EF · 08-10-2010, 09:08 AM

Boss motor looks massive in a B series engine bay let alone imagining one in an e series engine bay. lol would have to deal with a big increase in weight over the front!..

FPV+fteT3 · 08-10-2010, 09:10 AM

To keep the car well balanced and handling nice and not have any engineering issues I would stick with the lighter windsor. The Boss is quite a few kilo's heavier and physically a lot larger and could give rise to bonnet closing issues etc....A properly built windsor with alloy heads etc is a nice motor.

Fev · 08-10-2010, 09:15 AM

If your getting the engine and tranny for 5k thats damn good. Add in the cost of fitting them to the car and i'll say you'll be left with 5k (if you do a bit of the work yourself) for an exhaust system and intake mods, possible tune too. You'll have a unique and awesome ride!

kinksta · 08-10-2010, 09:22 AM

Windsor up front driving the front wheels, and boss in the boot running the rear wheels. I personally haven't seen that done yet, I dare ya hehe ;)

DBourne · 08-10-2010, 09:30 AM

If it was me, I'd be sticking with the windsor.

Built windsors with a nice lumpy cam sound ridiculously good and besides I'm sure your not after out and out speed otherwise you'd be in a turbo, so the Windsor wins as it'll sound better, be lighter yada yada.

geckoGT · 08-10-2010, 09:38 AM

I would stick with the windsor.

By the time you have bought the boss motor, modified the engine bay tot fit that huge lump of a motor in it, come up with a way to cure the bonnet problem (you think a BA bulge is big, yours would be enormous), fixed all the ECU issues etc, most of your money would be gone without a doubt. Not to mention the fact that you would have to get the whole thing engineered for registration.

Personally, I would not do it. The 260 is a good motor but I would not say it is a great motor, it just would not have a clear advantage over a nicely modded and tuned windsor. Added to that the boss weighs a heap more than the windsor so you will end up with a front heavy pig of a car in the handling department. I have driven many e series cars (owned a few) and to me they have always had great handling, certainly feel lighter and more responsive than B series. Why kill that with a big heavy lump over the front axles like the boss when you can get the same results from a lighter windsor?

geckoGT · 08-10-2010, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtBourne

If it was me, I'd be sticking with the windsor.

Built windsors with a nice lumpy cam sound ridiculously good and besides I'm sure your not after out and out speed otherwise you'd be in a turbo, so the Windsor wins as it'll sound better, be lighter yada yada.

Absolutely

I have never heard a boss motor that compares with the sound from a nicely modded windsor

SVTVNM · 08-10-2010, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geckoGT

Absolutely

I have never heard a boss motor that compares with the sound from a nicely modded windsor

AMEN!!

blownv8au · 08-10-2010, 11:17 AM

i agree with geckogt the money to set it up ie. tailshaft, getting around drive by wire and engineering plus all the extra weight when you could spend $10k on a windsor including an aftermarket block and the other $5k to setup a diff and box to handel the power. Not many boss powered cars would have a hope of keeping up with the light weight el with 500hp lol.

geckoGT · 08-10-2010, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blownv8au

i agree with geckogt the money to set it up ie. tailshaft, getting around drive by wire and engineering plus all the extra weight when you could spend $10k on a windsor including an aftermarket block and the other $5k to setup a diff and box to handel the power. Not many boss powered cars would have a hope of keeping up with the light weight el with 500hp lol.

Not to mention your modded windsor would produce more power and torque lower in the rev range for the same cost as the boss motor conversion.

To me it is an easy choice if you are on a budget, the windsor and $10k of performance mods is the easy winner. If budget was not an issue and the funds were available to do the conversion right, plus top it off with a nice PD blower setup, the choice would be different but that is $30-40k to do properly but the result would be something that no modded windsor would compare to.

b2tf · 08-10-2010, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtBourne

If it was me, I'd be sticking with the windsor.

Built windsors with a nice lumpy cam sound ridiculously good and besides I'm sure your not after out and out speed otherwise you'd be in a turbo, so the Windsor wins as it'll sound better, be lighter yada yada.

Agreed.

prasac · 08-10-2010, 11:37 AM

honestly either choice you make you can get away with it, but the Boss will give u more headaches, grey hairs and a lighter wallet. personally i'd stick to what it's got in it no ****ing around and it's already setup for it. the little things needed to do in a conversion all add up and it gets beyond a joke sometimes.

auxr · 08-10-2010, 11:51 AM

IMO, a no brainer - rebuild & mod the windsor - lighter, far, far less hassles than converting to a Boss - and as previously been said - you can't beat or replicate the sound from a tricked up windsor.

james22 · 08-10-2010, 11:54 AM

My 2 cents... Stick with the windsor. As mentioned above, The car is already setup and ready to go. Not anywhere near as much stuffing around. But then again I may be a little biased :-)

Cooper69S · 08-10-2010, 12:10 PM

Like others have said, I'd stick with a windsor because they sound awesome - I reckon my old 347 AU sounded ok even on LPG - do a youtube search for someblokefromwa and have a listen. a bloke up the street from me has an AU3 XR8 and it sounds unbelievable - haven't stopped him yet to ask what he's done to it but I've never heard a boss sound that good. also parts for windsors are plentiful and with the current exchange rate should be good value too since most are ex-USA. an alloy headed stroked windsor with a decent cam will get some very nice sounds coming from your engine bay...

Think very seriously about what you're likely to be expecting from this engine down the track. Some of us are not very honest with ourselves and say that we're just going to do a basic build up and be happy with that, when deep down you know you're going to keep on modding.
Reason being, if you're after a strong street setup eg alloy heads, cam, new manifold, maybe 331 or 347 stroker even, up to about 350 to 450 rwhp, then you possibly don't need the additional expense of an aftermarket block which leaves more in your budget for other goodies.
If you're thinking you'll be chasing big power down the track, then you could easily hit the limit that the factory block can handle and you'd have to start the engine build all over, so then you're better off going an aftermarket one to start with.
enjoy the project

Windsor342ci · 08-10-2010, 04:27 PM

Hi there Guys,

Thank you all for your detailed feedback! Just after I wrote this I made my way down to Spiro at Auto Tech Engineering to have a chat. He was leaning to the direction of the Boss motor.
Though I will be the 1st to admit there is nothing that sounds as good as a tricked up Windsor, Im just not completely sure if that is were it will end for me. And in all honesty, reflective of what Cooper69S mentioned, I dont want to spend that cash to only hit a wall and say crap....... I want more power.

I want a nice tough street car thats very well different to anything out there. I have done my dimensions and asked the question earlier in the Post Classic, and the size of the Boss wont be an issue from a Strut Towers point of view but defiantly will be needing a bulge!

Forced Induction was going to be a down the track plan and hence why Ive been thinking other engines.

Again thanks for your feedback guys!

grey_esp · 08-10-2010, 04:39 PM

ok just to throw a spanner in the works, why dont you get a 351W block, stroke that to like 427 and stick your blower on it. Still different to your everyday EL.probably make more power than the boss would and with a set of alloys would be a far bit lighter I would think.

TheZHLANE · 08-10-2010, 04:56 PM

look at some of the modded 5.0 stangs, insane

ZA-289 · 08-10-2010, 05:01 PM

Windsor all the way, but start with a decent aftermarket block.

Cooper69S · 08-10-2010, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELIIXR8

I want a nice tough street car thats very well different to anything out there.

A boss will certainly be different. If that's what you're after than a windsor possibly isn't for you, since no matter what you do in the budget you mentioned, it will be just another modded e-series. Would sound awesome and go hard, but certainly won't be 'different'.
If you wanted to wait a while a find a slightly bigger budget, an e-series coyote could be the go

Turboconvert · 08-10-2010, 06:08 PM

you said, you wanted something different. I agree with cooper69s. You can mod the windsor, but it will just be another highly worked windsor powered el. To be different requires a lot of vison. And a boss will be a good step forward in that department. But it will inevitably take a sizeable chuck of the money you have set aside if not all of it to get that done. But Im sure you have thought of this. And I will repeat what many people have said before me time and time again. The only thing that is stopping you is your imagination and money. Modding a car is all about what YOU want to achieve, not what some forum junky thinks. Now this forum junkie has had his 2 cents posted.

GTP owner · 08-10-2010, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELIIXR8

Hi there Guys,

Thank you all for your detailed feedback! Just after I wrote this I made my way down to Spiro at Auto Tech Engineering to have a chat. He was leaning to the direction of the Boss motor.
Though I will be the 1st to admit there is nothing that sounds as good as a tricked up Windsor, Im just not completely sure if that is were it will end for me. And in all honesty, reflective of what Cooper69S mentioned, I dont want to spend that cash to only hit a wall and say crap....... I want more power.

I want a nice tough street car thats very well different to anything out there. I have done my dimensions and asked the question earlier in the Post Classic, and the size of the Boss wont be an issue from a Strut Towers point of view but defiantly will be needing a bulge!

Forced Induction was going to be a down the track plan and hence why Ive been thinking other engines.

Again thanks for your feedback guys!

If you really want different - look at a ba xr6 turbo engine. That would be thinking outside the square. If it had to be a v8 - why not the 6L chev alloy out of a dunnydore?

The 260 is really going to upset the balance on the el, which is 200kg lighter than a ba-bf falcon. "Lead tipped bullet" is the name of that kind of handling. It will also cost heaps more than $5,000 to put it in. By the time you modify the strut towers, beef up the suspension and brakes, modify the electrics, new pipes, mounts, intake, compliancing costs etc....I would budget $10,000 doing it myself, and then it is still just a stock boss 260.
The windsor motor can really hoot. That budget would make an easy reliable 600hp, which is more than just a little bit of fun.

tezxr8man · 08-10-2010, 08:36 PM

How bout a coyote frm ford racing 6500 + 1500 for a manual loom and whatever for freight and you have a unique car with 400hp before you start and the dollar is great at the moment??????

**DJM83** · 08-10-2010, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grey_esp

ok just to throw a spanner in the works, why dont you get a 351W block, stroke that to like 427 and stick your blower on it. Still different to your everyday EL.probably make more power than the boss would and with a set of alloys would be a far bit lighter I would think.

I like this idea very much

FPV8U · 08-10-2010, 10:04 PM

Save some coin and get a new 5.0L Coyote otherwise stick with the Windsor, I love the Boss motor but in an EF/EL.. there would be Trucks that would handle better.

mrghia · 08-10-2010, 10:27 PM

how bout a crate motor plenty of them make 450+hp

**Falcon Coupe** · 08-10-2010, 10:47 PM

A picture speaks 1000 words.....

jixel 78 · 08-10-2010, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELIIXR8

Hi there Guys,

Thank you all for your detailed feedback! Just after I wrote this I made my way down to Spiro at Auto Tech Engineering to have a chat. He was leaning to the direction of the Boss motor.
Though I will be the 1st to admit there is nothing that sounds as good as a tricked up Windsor, Im just not completely sure if that is were it will end for me. And in all honesty, reflective of what Cooper69S mentioned, I dont want to spend that cash to only hit a wall and say crap....... I want more power.

I want a nice tough street car thats very well different to anything out there. I have done my dimensions and asked the question earlier in the Post Classic, and the size of the Boss wont be an issue from a Strut Towers point of view but defiantly will be needing a bulge!

Forced Induction was going to be a down the track plan and hence why Ive been thinking other engines.

Again thanks for your feedback guys!

Of course they`d say that! You`d be funnelling a lot more cash their way than if they just bombed a Whinger.