Real last Aust Falcon

xr8cam · 14-10-2016, 05:23 PM

If the last true Falcon is a measure of where the car and its parts are sourced, made and assembled, then wouldn't the AU3 XR8 be the last 'true' Aus built Falcon?

**Peuty** · 14-10-2016, 05:36 PM

Interesting theory.

Show your working please.

STINKY NINJA · 14-10-2016, 06:12 PM

Windsor is from the us,6 cyl is made in aus

**janddbone** · 14-10-2016, 06:54 PM

BA Turbo would get that gong I reckon.

**Raptor** · 14-10-2016, 07:20 PM

Do imported components count?

Cylinder heads etc. I think you'd need to go back much further than AU/BA.

You'd be surprised.

.

Sprint XR8 · 14-10-2016, 08:10 PM

The last Falcon with an all local motor (block and heads cast in Geelong),was the last XE V8 Cleveland in 1982.
The XD iron head crossflow was the last all local 6.

Trump · 14-10-2016, 09:03 PM

Where have the heads been cast?

Bolly47 · 14-10-2016, 09:09 PM

[QUOTE=Loud_Noises;5788909]Where have the heads been cast?[/QUOTE
Mexico ....

**Raptor** · 14-10-2016, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

Where have the heads been cast?

Brazil I think.

Most of the suspension components and diffs come from there too.

They have been considered local content only because the onsite supplier puts them together in Aus. before they hand them over to Ford.

I was very disappointed once I discovered where much of my Territory came from. I thought I was buying Australian because it would help.

[edit] ok, heads from Mexico. Diffs and suspension arms (ball joints

) Brazil.

.

Sprint XR8 · 14-10-2016, 09:12 PM

The barra heads were cast in Mexico, the company supplying them was Nemak.

castellan · 14-10-2016, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprint XR8

The last Falcon with an all local motor (block and heads cast in Geelong),was the last XE V8 Cleveland in 1982.
The XD iron head crossflow was the last all local 6.

Yes that's correct and the X Flow Alloy head was made in Japan by Honda.

Holden have just stoped making the V6 and have stockpiled what they will need.
The V6 blocks were imported but the alloy Heads were made in Aus and the rest.

I would of thought Ford would of made the OHC alloy heads here, I think the twin camshafts come from China from what I heard, not a fact.

xr8cam · 14-10-2016, 11:37 PM

I was of the belief the Windsor has been used in this country since the XR with the 289. Is the AU the last incarnation of this motor in Aus. There is a video on youtube about the Tickford input in AU development and he was saying how important it was that this car was built here and the engine components made here etc. I remember being suprised at how Australian this car really was, design, materials, local parts builders and assembly all local too. It must be up there with one of the more Aus cars designed & built here. The satisfaction I get everytime I turn the key in my car, the sound of the motor and the exhaust note. I take a lot of pleasure in that I stick with older local cars when talking to others who drive imports & tuners. Enjoying all the comments.

tranquilized · 15-10-2016, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xr8cam

I was of the belief the Windsor has been used in this country since the XR with the 289.

The Windsor was dropped for the XY which used the Cleveland. EB - AU went back to the Windsor imported from the USA though it received a lot of local development towards the end.

castellan · 15-10-2016, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranquilized

The Windsor was dropped for the XY which used the Cleveland. EB - AU went back to the Windsor imported from the USA though it received a lot of local development towards the end.

The 302 Windsor was in the XY.

The last 302 Windsor that was stroked, crank rods and pistons and all parts came from where ? USA or AUS.

66 STANG · 15-10-2016, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranquilized

The Windsor was dropped for the XY which used the Cleveland. EB - AU went back to the Windsor imported from the USA though it received a lot of local development towards the end.

All 302 XY's were windsors. The Cleveland 302 didn't start until the XA run. I think even some of the early XA's had winsors as well.

roddy1960 · 15-10-2016, 03:08 PM

G'day all..Last real Aussie Falcon is an interesting question..Could be any number of them depending on what criteria you chose...

..My old AU ll had racked up over 500 kms this week and needed a top up of joy juice at the local servo yesterday arvo. ....Just as I was paying I noticed a 2009 VW Tiguan with electronic issues and with a worried owner.. The local mechanic had got it going but it needed dealer attention to be sure of the type of failure . After the owner gingerly drove away he told me he's already noticing way too many similar fails on a near daily basis , faults and issues with European sourced engine/ drivetrains but especially with small capacity turbo diesels as this one was..
He commented the higher revving Euro's are generally more stressed , are often failing and he has serious doubts that they'll match the reliability of Australian and US and Japanese sourced vehicles..This is a bloke who's worked on more cars than most of us have had hot dinners and owns the real deal XB GT among other Fords..
Regardless of which Falcon was the last real Aussie one , I'm bloody glad I've got two of the buggers...
Time will tell but the absolute tried and tested reliability of a higher capacity less stressed lower revving I6 or V8.. Aussie Falcon is proven..much less so just yet with many Euro and Korean fare... Cheers Rod..

blk6t · 17-10-2016, 07:59 AM

Wonder what the cost would have been to buy if they made all Aussie Falcon's, right up to the FGX?

Would be an interesting comparison...

Wretched · 17-10-2016, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roddy1960

G'day all..Last real Aussie Falcon is an interesting question..Could be any number of them depending on what criteria you chose...

..My old AU ll had racked up over 500 kms this week and needed a top up of joy juice at the local servo yesterday arvo. ....Just as I was paying I noticed a 2009 VW Tiguan with electronic issues and with a worried owner.. The local mechanic had got it going but it needed dealer attention to be sure of the type of failure . After the owner gingerly drove away he told me he's already noticing way too many similar fails on a near daily basis , faults and issues with European sourced engine/ drivetrains but especially with small capacity turbo diesels as this one was..
He commented the higher revving Euro's are generally more stressed , are often failing and he has serious doubts that they'll match the reliability of Australian and US and Japanese sourced vehicles..This is a bloke who's worked on more cars than most of us have had hot dinners and owns the real deal XB GT among other Fords..
Regardless of which Falcon was the last real Aussie one , I'm bloody glad I've got two of the buggers...
Time will tell but the absolute tried and tested reliability of a higher capacity less stressed lower revving I6 or V8.. Aussie Falcon is proven..much less so just yet with many Euro and Korean fare... Cheers Rod..

Interesting theory, be keen to know at what stage these highly stressed European cars start having issues.
I am on 185,000km right now with only a timing belt changed.
We have 3 petrol VWs and another Focus ST all except the Golf R above 100,000km and still only doing regular maintenance.
May be we're just very very lucky.

For the other members on this forum with their European time bombs, how are you all going?

As for the topic at hand, last Australian Falcon was the FGX. Don't care about content, etc. The FGX was the last Falcon made in Australia.

jakkes · 17-10-2016, 11:22 AM

all australian falcon you're kidding yourself none of them have been all australian every car on the world wide market would have parts on it from some other country

Bossxr8 · 17-10-2016, 01:06 PM

Most aussie I would say an AU 6 cylinder. Maybe an EL as the AU window glass came from China and not down the road at Pilkingtons. Cylinder heads were cast here until the BA when the casting was done in Mexico but machined here.

V8's don't count cause of the imported block and heads.

Dr Terry · 17-10-2016, 04:03 PM

I believe that the most 'Australian' Falcon would be XA & XB. XR-XY 6-cyl would also be high in parts content, but they were very US in design content.

Back in those days even the car radio & speakers were made in Australia.

You would be hard pressed to find an imported component of any sort, in a basic XA/XB.

In the later cars, things like EFI fuel pumps, injectors, ECUs, also power steering pumps, air cond compressors & all electronics etc were all imported. OK, power steer pumps & air cond compressors have always been imported, but the base models didn't have them, which means that their % of local content was very high.

During the 70s, Holden, Falcon, Valiant & P76 were often above 99% local content. Since the mid 80s these numbers were simply unachievable.

Dr Terry

malazn mafia · 17-10-2016, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprint XR8

The barra heads were cast in Mexico, the company supplying them was Nemak.

So can we hit up Nemak to cook us up some XR6 turbo heads in the future ?

b2tf · 17-10-2016, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roddy1960

..My old AU ll had racked up over 500 kms this week and needed a top up of joy juice at the local servo yesterday arvo. ....Just as I was paying I noticed a 2009 VW Tiguan with electronic issues and with a worried owner.. The local mechanic had got it going but it needed dealer attention to be sure of the type of failure . After the owner gingerly drove away he told me he's already noticing way too many similar fails on a near daily basis , faults and issues with European sourced engine/ drivetrains but especially with small capacity turbo diesels as this one was..

Missing what this has to do with the question?

commodorenutt · 17-10-2016, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

So can we hit up Nemak to cook us up some XR6 turbo heads in the future ?

Probably not. The company I work for received requests from Ford AU to audit all tooling pertaining to Aussie manufacturing, and either send it back, or destroy it if it was not economic to send (ie too heavy).

roddy1960 · 17-10-2016, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Missing what this has to do with the question?

G'day...Point is this ..REAL AUSSIE FALCON..Any of them are tried and tested. The European , Korean etc stuff coming in are pretenders just at the moment and which ever Falcon is considered the 'last' true Aussie Falcon but how long's a piece of string..will most likely prove to be more than a match for the stuff we're about to endure..Cheers Rod..

Mick Haller · 17-10-2016, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 66 STANG

All 302 XY's were windsors. The Cleveland 302 didn't start until the XA run. I think even some of the early XA's had winsors as well.

You think right, my 302 XA was a Windsor.

**ebxr8240** · 17-10-2016, 09:09 PM

Yes the 302 Clevo was Aust design .. No such thing in US..

xr8cam · 17-10-2016, 09:21 PM

I was of the belief that the windsor kicked off in 289 guise with the XRGT then grew to 302 with the XTGT. After that I thought it stayed on for a a long run. I can't remember the cleveland dates and then which had 2V & 4V heads etc etc

malazn mafia · 17-10-2016, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by commodorenutt

Probably not. The company I work for received requests from Ford AU to audit all tooling pertaining to Aussie manufacturing, and either send it back, or destroy it if it was not economic to send (ie too heavy).

Just Ford policy ? What does Ford stand to lose if other companies continue to make parts for Falcons or even entire Falcons elsewhere ??

commodorenutt · 17-10-2016, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

Just Ford policy ? What does Ford stand to lose if other companies continue to make parts for Falcons or even entire Falcons elsewhere ??

in most cases you'll find Ford owns the tooling, and if they want it destroyed, you have to comply.

They're not in the business of supporting restorers - once the spare parts allocation dries up, they simply close the book - it costs too much money to warehouse & control all that stock. They want you to buy a new car from them, rather than fix the 5-10 year old item that doesn't generate any profit for them.

There's also the IP aspect - they aren't going to freely allow any supplier to utilise their design/IP to manufacture replacement parts for profit, from the original tooling, and send then out the back door (although it does happen in China) - most suppliers who have ongoing contracts with Ford globally wouldn't even consider it, and would comply in the first instance to the scrap request.